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T O P I C R E V I E WPixieJaneIt just occurred to me reading more than one thread in this forum today (which reminded me of others in the past) how similar Libra and Cappie are in some ways and yet are seen as radically different.The stereotype of both is that they're concerned with social image, typically a sophisticated one because they know that right or wrong they're going to be judged by it and want to be treated well, often with a goal of advancement, and both can be tempted to hide their authentic selves in a desire to promote the image that they think will get them what they want (this shouldn't be mistaken for spinelessness and confronting either a Libra or a Capricorn in a way they consider unacceptable is a good way to find out about their iron fists hidden within their silk gloves). Both cardinal masculine (yep, Libra is a masculine sign, not feminine) signs also tend to care about rules and laws and believe that consequences are natural and should be enforced when necessary (but not in the same exact way) and both can be dispassionate in judging (and even punishing) others in a way that many others, such as vengeful Scorpio or passionate Aries, sometimes find inexplicable ('course Judge Judy doesn't come off as dispassionate at all, and she has a Libra stellium which includes Venus and Mars as well as Sun, and she also has a Pisces moon which I know will surprise many here, best I can figure it is her cardinal Libra traits mix with her Gemini Saturn that that make her struggle to have clear thoughts and procedures so that her Scales are very sensitive--and thus passionate acting as judge and arbiter--when any sort of legal trickery or sloppiness is practiced or she senses someone is trying to game the system). OTOH, Libra and Cappie are square, Libra attempts to see things from the point of view of others more while Cappie is more ambitious and less flustered than Libra (but also less flexible). However, this doesn't mean that Cappie is without empathy, feeling, or ability to adapt nor that cardinal Libra lacks ambition or a spine. The "flavor" is different (I'm not sure how to put it into words) yet they're actually a lot alike, I'd say very similar but with different priorities. And yet Libra keeps being painted as someone spineless and often as a diva (sometimes even the men) associated with fashion magazines (which would be half-true at best unless their line of work or crowd encouraged that in which case Libra would be more inclined to critique the fashions rather than slavishly follow them) while Capricorn keeps being painted as cold and even brutally opportunistic, even mercenary, and if you can't give them something they want then they'll discard you without a second thought. I don't get it to the point that I don't even know how to ask save "Why!?" The best I can figure it is it's because Libra is air while Cappie is earth.Anyone want to take a stab at explaining it?EllynlvxSaturn is Exalted in Libra.PlutoSurvivorCapricorn is Feminine, not Masculine. All Earth and Water are Feminine. All Fire and Air are Masculine.PixieJane^^Oops, I am corrected. I got confused because the sign I normally see is that of goat with horns and beard which I see as masculine. I've seen goats without horns before and assumed they were female rather than modified artificially. (I'm currently reading the wiki entry on goats right now.)Still, that only deepens the mystery to me of why Libra and Capricorn are seen as they are despite being similar in so many ways.StarlightSmileSupremeLibra can feel an affinity to Capricorn due to Saturn being so happy here, and this planet rules Capricorn, but that's where the similarity ends even though Libra can be quite serious and disciplined, what's essential to Libra is comfort and they do like interactions with optimistic people who will bolster their dreams instead of raining all over their parade. Capricorn is where Mars is exalted and happiest, and has little affinity with Venus so this sign can welcome difficulty and strife. Libra doesn't really like to be criticized and dislikes having their dreams deflated with too much pessimism. This sign likes a congenial environment with graceful, happy people and pleasing surroundings due to Venus's influence. Libra likes to spend money on the exterior while Capricorn doesn't always see the need. Better to soldier on, do without, and keep the money in the bank is Capricorn's thinking. Empire building can be Capricorn's ambition, and that takes savings.Capricorn could depress Libra. PixieJaneI haven't found most Cappies to be that depressing or discouraging (if anything, Libra seems more inclined to whine or talk about the unfairness of the world). I have found them refreshingly realistic, however, but it's not a type of realism that's discouraging, it can even be encouraging. Maybe my Sag bolsters me so that I'm not as bothered and my Cappie Lilith also makes me sympathetic to dangers that they see. (I'm not a big splurger either, though like any Libra I can go between extremes which means sometimes I'll blow a huge amount at once or--usually right before and/or after a big splurge--become a tightwad, at least for myself, which may be my 2H being Virgo.) I did find one Capricorn such a downer that I could barely stand it...though oddly he splurged a lot more than I would on purchases that were just stupid, I was the one trying to show him how to save money but he had the stubborness of a Bull refusing to change even when it would help him not be so miserable. It seems to me Cappies are just as concerned as Libra about their appearances and for the same reason: status and respectability. Of course I can think of exceptions among both Cappies and Libras, but those that were very different had been horribly abused while growing up. (ETA: And I've found Cappies don't handle criticism well or failing to get credit when credit is due which can make them as touchy as Libra...and probably less forgiving about it.)Ironically, I think I've even found Cappies to be more fair than Libra...and yet that's fuzzy to me because Libra will try to see the other point of view more readily than Cappie and also more willing to take extenuating circumstances into account. Yet when I make a deal with a Cappie they live up to their end of the bargain a lot more dependably without making excuses than Libras, generally speaking. Always, generally speaking. In no way do I intend to put down Libra here, I'm just doing my best to be fair here (even if most can't understand that). And interesting enough I've known a surprising amount of Libra/Capricorn love matches, which doesn't surprise me given how compatible they can be in so many ways (even though they square)...that said I've never known a Capricorn in a romantic context myself.12muddyFrom what I've seen, compared to myself, Libras are more likely to be considerate/fair to other people (not that I can't be, it's just that often justice and fairness aren't my top priorities, there are other things, other factors that come into play). Sometimes that tendency puts them at a disadvantage (especially when they have to deal with people who mistake thoughtful kindness for cowardice). And sometimes one can not be fair to all. Libras I know are idealistic that way. My s.o once worked as a translator/interpreter for a guy who got quite an attitude. One day in a meeting he called one of his female staff a "stupid cow". My s.o spoke up and eventually started a debate which ended up with him getting fired. I admire the hell out of him, although some said it wasn't smart of him to do so, given our financial situation at that time. I get what they mean, but still, I love what he did. Free LeonI've noticed the similarities you mention, both on this forum and through my experiences. I think the underlying reason behind some of these similarities is the essence of the driving force--to initiate (cardinal) projects/events/situations in order to fulfill an inherent spiritual goal. That goal depends on the sign, and if the person is a soul-centered individual.Aries (1st): to establish one's identity/embody the qualities of their soul, to exercise the right use of willpower, and to inspire heightened spiritual awareness into all endeavors. Cancer (4th): to evolve into an individual of limitless compassion, to access the tremendous inner reserves of nurturing, and to be a secure anchor for self/others.Libra (7th): to balance the lower self with the higher self/align the personality developed in this lifetime with the soul, to personify right human relations, and strive to create unity between all persons.Capricorn (10th): to synthesize the goals of the other 3 cardinal signs in order to materialize the Divine Plan.I believe this applies more to Rising signs than Sun signs.tgemI knew a girl who has a moon, venus, mars, pluto stellium in Libra. She was the BIGGEST DEBBIE DOWNER I've ever met. Had to end our friendship because I felt my energy sucked out of me every time I was around her...(cringe)StarlightSmileSupremeThat reminds me of Daria.RandallAh, I see. Opposite Signs can be alike.
The stereotype of both is that they're concerned with social image, typically a sophisticated one because they know that right or wrong they're going to be judged by it and want to be treated well, often with a goal of advancement, and both can be tempted to hide their authentic selves in a desire to promote the image that they think will get them what they want (this shouldn't be mistaken for spinelessness and confronting either a Libra or a Capricorn in a way they consider unacceptable is a good way to find out about their iron fists hidden within their silk gloves).
Both cardinal masculine (yep, Libra is a masculine sign, not feminine) signs also tend to care about rules and laws and believe that consequences are natural and should be enforced when necessary (but not in the same exact way) and both can be dispassionate in judging (and even punishing) others in a way that many others, such as vengeful Scorpio or passionate Aries, sometimes find inexplicable ('course Judge Judy doesn't come off as dispassionate at all, and she has a Libra stellium which includes Venus and Mars as well as Sun, and she also has a Pisces moon which I know will surprise many here, best I can figure it is her cardinal Libra traits mix with her Gemini Saturn that that make her struggle to have clear thoughts and procedures so that her Scales are very sensitive--and thus passionate acting as judge and arbiter--when any sort of legal trickery or sloppiness is practiced or she senses someone is trying to game the system).
OTOH, Libra and Cappie are square, Libra attempts to see things from the point of view of others more while Cappie is more ambitious and less flustered than Libra (but also less flexible). However, this doesn't mean that Cappie is without empathy, feeling, or ability to adapt nor that cardinal Libra lacks ambition or a spine. The "flavor" is different (I'm not sure how to put it into words) yet they're actually a lot alike, I'd say very similar but with different priorities.
And yet Libra keeps being painted as someone spineless and often as a diva (sometimes even the men) associated with fashion magazines (which would be half-true at best unless their line of work or crowd encouraged that in which case Libra would be more inclined to critique the fashions rather than slavishly follow them) while Capricorn keeps being painted as cold and even brutally opportunistic, even mercenary, and if you can't give them something they want then they'll discard you without a second thought. I don't get it to the point that I don't even know how to ask save "Why!?"
The best I can figure it is it's because Libra is air while Cappie is earth.
Anyone want to take a stab at explaining it?
Oops, I am corrected.
I got confused because the sign I normally see is that of goat with horns and beard which I see as masculine. I've seen goats without horns before and assumed they were female rather than modified artificially. (I'm currently reading the wiki entry on goats right now.)
Still, that only deepens the mystery to me of why Libra and Capricorn are seen as they are despite being similar in so many ways.
Capricorn is where Mars is exalted and happiest, and has little affinity with Venus so this sign can welcome difficulty and strife. Libra doesn't really like to be criticized and dislikes having their dreams deflated with too much pessimism. This sign likes a congenial environment with graceful, happy people and pleasing surroundings due to Venus's influence. Libra likes to spend money on the exterior while Capricorn doesn't always see the need. Better to soldier on, do without, and keep the money in the bank is Capricorn's thinking. Empire building can be Capricorn's ambition, and that takes savings.
Capricorn could depress Libra.
I did find one Capricorn such a downer that I could barely stand it...though oddly he splurged a lot more than I would on purchases that were just stupid, I was the one trying to show him how to save money but he had the stubborness of a Bull refusing to change even when it would help him not be so miserable.
It seems to me Cappies are just as concerned as Libra about their appearances and for the same reason: status and respectability. Of course I can think of exceptions among both Cappies and Libras, but those that were very different had been horribly abused while growing up. (ETA: And I've found Cappies don't handle criticism well or failing to get credit when credit is due which can make them as touchy as Libra...and probably less forgiving about it.)
Ironically, I think I've even found Cappies to be more fair than Libra...and yet that's fuzzy to me because Libra will try to see the other point of view more readily than Cappie and also more willing to take extenuating circumstances into account. Yet when I make a deal with a Cappie they live up to their end of the bargain a lot more dependably without making excuses than Libras, generally speaking. Always, generally speaking. In no way do I intend to put down Libra here, I'm just doing my best to be fair here (even if most can't understand that).
And interesting enough I've known a surprising amount of Libra/Capricorn love matches, which doesn't surprise me given how compatible they can be in so many ways (even though they square)...that said I've never known a Capricorn in a romantic context myself.
My s.o once worked as a translator/interpreter for a guy who got quite an attitude. One day in a meeting he called one of his female staff a "stupid cow". My s.o spoke up and eventually started a debate which ended up with him getting fired. I admire the hell out of him, although some said it wasn't smart of him to do so, given our financial situation at that time. I get what they mean, but still, I love what he did.
I think the underlying reason behind some of these similarities is the essence of the driving force--to initiate (cardinal) projects/events/situations in order to fulfill an inherent spiritual goal. That goal depends on the sign, and if the person is a soul-centered individual.
Aries (1st): to establish one's identity/embody the qualities of their soul, to exercise the right use of willpower, and to inspire heightened spiritual awareness into all endeavors.
Cancer (4th): to evolve into an individual of limitless compassion, to access the tremendous inner reserves of nurturing, and to be a secure anchor for self/others.
Libra (7th): to balance the lower self with the higher self/align the personality developed in this lifetime with the soul, to personify right human relations, and strive to create unity between all persons.
Capricorn (10th): to synthesize the goals of the other 3 cardinal signs in order to materialize the Divine Plan.
I believe this applies more to Rising signs than Sun signs.
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